Poster: Solidify at 6/8/2005 6:12:06 AM PDT
Subject: The reason rank gain is slow this week. |
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Hopefully people will read this.
Here are some reasons. I'm not saying it's not a bug, I strongly doubt it.
The rank system is designed to be like the experience system. As you gain ranks, it becomes harder to gain further ranks, just like experience. Remember when you first started, and you went from levels 1-20 in a week or two? How long did 50-60 take in comparison? It's the same here. Getting those last few ranks will take longer.
Additionally, it's a ladder system. People are going to start flatlining at the rank that's suitable for them, so you might that you're starting to raise rank very slowly at what seems like quite a low rank. This is because your performance dictates that you're approaching -your- max level.
The way the points are calculated, you will settle to the rank that's suitable for you. If you're unhappy with that, then you need to work harder in PvP and get a better standing. But you need to do it consistently. Getting lots of CPs in one week will not suddenly boost you many ranks. You'll need to get the same number of CPs for a few weeks running. When you stop to think about this, you'll realise that it rewards people who are consistently performing well.
I hope that helps.[ post edited by Solidify ]
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Poster: Thundgot at 6/8/2005 7:00:41 AM PDT
Subject: Re: The reason rank gain is slow this week. |
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Your rank after each week's calculation is a function of your old rank and the rank you would have if the last week was the only week counting. These two are compared, and your new rank will be somewhere in-between the two - very much closer to the old rank than the "week rank", naturally.
This means that yes, it's likely that people's progress might be stalling about this time, and some actually start dropping in rank because they are less active compared to others. I guess it's time to enter the Battlegrounds and gather the very significant honor you can pick up there. ;)
Thundgot
Community Manager, English
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Poster: Thundgot at 6/8/2005 7:05:07 AM PDT
Subject: Re: The reason rank gain is slow this week. |
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Q u o t e:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but the way I understand your explanation, this system will be, just like the high level instances, not something for the casual gamer. Or will there be a chance for a casual gamer to walk around in the Epic pvp rewards some day?
If not, then there truly is nothing left after 60 for the casual gamer.
Instances that take too long, and pvp battles you will mostly lose because of your bad equipment.
I would never expect a casual gamer to attain the highest ranks in the honor system. The system rewards activity, and while you can be casual and still attain the lower and middle ranks you should really not expect to compete with those who spend a lot of their time PvPing and doing so with much skill and efficiency.
You can do fairly well in PvP without the best equipment though. We're not talking duels here.
Thundgot
Community Manager, English
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Poster: Thundgot at 6/8/2005 7:12:52 AM PDT
Subject: Re: The reason rank gain is slow this week. |
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Q u o t e:
Thundgot, can I post in blue, please? It seems that I say something, and it's ignored, and then you say more or less the same thing, and it's gospel.
; )
I know. It's far from convenient at all times though. :p
Thundgot
Community Manager, English
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Poster: Thundgot at 6/8/2005 7:20:25 AM PDT
Subject: Re: The reason rank gain is slow this week. |
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Q u o t e:
On which note, can you see our alts alongside our posts? I suspect you can....
That is highly classified information. ;)
Thundgot
Community Manager, English
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Poster: Thundgot at 6/8/2005 10:02:16 AM PDT
Subject: Re: The reason rank gain is slow this week. |
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Q u o t e:
Just what I still dont understand is, i was standing 21 last week and now 14, but not gain any rank?? And I PvP'd more then ever. :S
Maybe everyone PvPed more than ever? I know there was a lot of activity this week, for sure.
The point is, if you're roughly equally active each week compared to everybody else (10000 points compared to a total of 200000 for your side is better then 20000 compared to 800000 for your side), you get roughly the same "week rank" each week. As the weeks progress your "permanent rank" will move closer and closer to your "week rank", each time with a smaller step since the gap is smaller. This week is likely the time where the steps are getting so small you simply don't gain a full rank per week anymore.
Q u o t e:
I think Blizz got it bugged this week.
Last week I got 73k CP , I was rank 11 and still rank 11. Standing 2 for the last week.
I am not saying because I didnt upgrade in rank , but I asked many people , 99% didnt have his rank changed.
I conclude to this that Blizz has counted only 1 or 2 days in honor calculations this week.
So that only a few people could upgrade because they were close to the upper rank boundaries.
Now I am aware that it gets harder and harder to upgrade in rank when you are in higher ranks. But for the last 3 weeks I was getting 1 more rank each time , with 60-70k CP.
We need clarification about this please...
Thank you very much in advance ..
If those 99% were roughly as active this week as they've been since the Hono(u)r System was introduced, that sounds about right. 6 weeks at the same "week rank" means your "permanent rank" is getting close to where it'll stay at your average score. Advancement from here is going to be noticeably slower.
One more rank for three weeks is pretty good, especially when that's ranks 8 to 11. I would guess your week rank is 13. If you keep the "week rank" between 13 and 14 (and above 14) for a couple more weeks you should see rank 12.
With the exception of the 4 and 8 day weeks when the maintenance day changed the script running each week is the same. I very much doubt it suddenly changed "7 days" to "2 days".
Q u o t e:
so you are saying, with 2000+ cps i don't get past rank 3 ?? And no one else on my server got up rank, because this is how the system works? I dont believe it
How much Honor (Contribution Points) it takes to get a high "week rank" depends entirely on the other players in your faction on the realm. If none of them had more than 100 Honor for the week, you'd get a fairly good week rank. It wouldn't be extremely high as your faction hardly got any Honor at all, but you could advance a rank. If everybody else got 5000 Honor for the week, you might actually drop a rank with your 2000.
Thundgot
Community Manager, English
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Poster: Thundgot at 6/8/2005 10:06:36 AM PDT
Subject: Re: The reason rank gain is slow this week. |
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Additional note: I will most definitely see whether we can share some more details and a more thorough explanation of how the system works. Replies like this do get a bit limited without being able to share exact details, and it's not very structured when it's spread over several posts and threads.
Thundgot
Community Manager, English
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Poster: Thundgot at 6/8/2005 10:22:12 AM PDT
Subject: Re: The reason rank gain is slow this week. |
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Q u o t e:
Last week i had 10000 cp (standing 14)and get rank 7 (from 6). This week i had 15000 cp (standing 9) and didnt get a new rank... no comments. Shame on you Blizz...
Again, the Honor (CP) must always be compared to the others on the realm. 15k one week isn't necessarily better than 10k the other.
Now, you did in fact get a higher Standing, meaning fewer people got more points than you, so your 15k Honor should (providing your faction in total was equally active this week as last week) have provided you with a better "week rank" and thus an improvement of your "permanent rank". It does not mean you definitely gain a new rank title, but you should be closer.
Thundgot
Community Manager, English
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Poster: Thundgot at 6/8/2005 10:24:28 AM PDT
Subject: Re: The reason rank gain is slow this week. |
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Q u o t e:
hahaha even the blizzard guys here dont know how the pvp system works^^ (well they do, but there answers pretend to be excuses, nothing more)
explain me how someone with 1 standing could be warlord then? where is the improvement...
just get the fact that 50% didnt got a rank and that the STANDING counts and the standing some ppl have is enough to get a rank, instead of finding excuses pls just fix it and maybe answer gm tickets or sth. since tomorrow i didnt got an answer on my ticket and still i can not play my warlock because he is still invisible and wears invisible stuff (besides that i still got no rank wich i would have got if everything went right).
I can assure you I know the system fairly well. There are some blanks, simply because I don't have the exact formulas available, but I couldn't share those anyway.
Claiming something is broken and that proper replies are just "excuses" because you don't understand the system or you didn't get what you want is very unconstructive. Please try avoid such.
Thundgot
Community Manager, English
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Poster: Thundgot at 6/8/2005 10:27:05 AM PDT
Subject: Re: The reason rank gain is slow this week. |
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And I'll just add that I in no way exclude the possibility of miscalculation and errors. I will of course ask for this to be checked again. Some just seem a bit too eager to claim the system is at fault when they don't get the results they want. Edit: Hopefully a more thorough explanation of the system will help on that. [ post edited by Thundgot ]
Thundgot
Community Manager, English
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Poster: Thundgot at 6/8/2005 10:59:35 AM PDT
Subject: Re: The reason rank gain is slow this week. |
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Q u o t e:
ok let me ask a question. now i started PvPing whit this char last week. and i had about 30 kills total befor last maitinece and i gained rank 1.
This maitinence i had about 350-400 total kill's,But didnt get a rank?
Im still private. and for my lvl and getting mostly all my kills in STV and in small groups and solo i think i did pretty good??
Now i would think i should get alteast one rank? move up to rank 2 ? i have a buddy at the same lvl as me and we fight and do most stuff togheter and he had a little more CP/honor points than me but he didnt move any more either.. still a low life private !
Now i know 1k-1,5K CP aint much in 1 week. But i would presume at my low lvl i shoul atleast get to rank 2 ? And none in my other guild had any advancement in the rank's either last i was on as far as i could see? And they dont do anything but PvP all the time.Atleast 1 only 1 "should" have gained one rank.
None i have talked to have gained a rank as far as i know.So something must be wrong.
Now the reason i havent gotten a rank might be because im a little low but i think i have been fairly active in the PvP area the last week.
And this char hadent been played whit until last week,befor that was befor the honor patch went live. :)
Honorable Kills have no effect on your "week rank" except to determine whether you reach the cut-off for the week. It's all about your Honor (Contribution Points). 1000 to 1500 Honor in a week on a PvP realm like Zenedar, and you also having lower "week rank" gain from those points as you're a bit lower than level 60... I'd say it's about right.
If the rest of the players of your faction had regular activity for one of the mid-activity PvP realms you'd have a "week rank" of 2 or 3, which might or might not get you that second permanent rank, depending on how close you were last week.
About the others in your guild, I'd need more details. See my next reply though, where I'll try a bit more explaining without revealing things I can reveal (yet).
Thundgot
Community Manager, English
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Poster: Thundgot at 6/8/2005 11:15:45 AM PDT
Subject: Re: The reason rank gain is slow this week. |
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Q u o t e:
then pls explain me why for the first time 50% of my guild /about 80 members) did not got a rank while they all highly active and always got one?
I'll try.
Among your 80 members I dare make the assumption (for this explanation) that 40 are active PvPers, 20 are very active, and 20 just do what PvP that comes naturally on a PvP realm. Let's also assume that all of you have kept a steady pace all these 6-7 weeks the honor system has been active, and that you are among the very active guilds on the Horde side.
For the sake of this example I determine that one of your 20 very active guys each week get a "week rank" of 12. Your regular guys get a week rank of 8, and the less active guys get a week rank of 5. During the 7 calculations that have been done so far each member will move from "permanent rank" 0 towards their week rank in smaller and smaller steps. For each of the groups it will look roughly like this:
Less active: 2 - 3 - 3 - 3 - 4 - 4 - 4
Regular: 3 - 4 - 4 - 5 - 6 - 6 - 6
Very active: 4 - 5 - 6 - 7 - 8 - 9 - 9
As you see with these numbers none of you got a rank this week. Next week at the same level the most active might get another rank, and maybe even the regular ones.
Disclaimer: these numbers are just an example, not a fully correct mirror of the system.
Q u o t e:
explain why ppl with better standing then ago, with enough standing where others got rank 8/9/10 whatever did not got the rank?
I'm afraid I'm not sure what you're asking here. If you mean to ask why Bob, having the same rank and better Standing last week than Ted, and now got the roughly same Standing as Ted, did not get a rank while Ted did... maybe Bob was lower on the rank two weeks ago? Also note that if Bob is lower level than Ted his Honor (CP) will count for less rank, even if he had better Standing.
Q u o t e:
well i guess you can not because you dont really know what happened. just check it, i dont know about your possibilities to check, but if you would check sth like % +1 rank of all players last weak and players +1 rank this weak, wich will be like 10% of last weak, then you would simply see that there is sth wrong.
Each week after the release of the Honor system there will be less people getting a rank. This drop in people gaining a new rank will be bigger for each week until the system is very stabile except for newcomers and those who change their activity a lot. Nothing wrong with that at all.
Q u o t e:
i got told several cp/standing of last weak/week ago of some guildmembers wich just show that the ranks are not updated right this week.
all i want is that you check it and fix it, because you cant say everything is fine when there is obvoiusly not.
I hope my explanation above showed you that it's not that obvious. Again, please don't brush off any explanation as wrong and the system as bugged simply because you don't understand how it works.
And again, I'm not excluding the possibility of errors. I'm just trying to show you that what you describe is fully possible - even completely natural - without any bugs or calculation errors.
Thundgot
Community Manager, English
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Poster: Thundgot at 6/8/2005 11:20:15 AM PDT
Subject: Re: The reason rank gain is slow this week. |
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Q u o t e:
Last week I was a Corporal, this week I'm still a Corporal - albeit a confused one.
Can anyone explain how I achieved a higher standing on Dragonmaw (of 454) than my guildmate, who is a Master Sergeant (standing 470) and yet did not gain a rank?
Carillon
*confused*
Note that 16 places on the standing list can be as little as 10 points difference on the "week rank". One can safely assume that the two of you got the exact same week rank.
Given this I would guess you moved closer to the Sergeant rank, but clearly not enough to reach it yet. Your friend might have advanced a little towards Knight, but less than you advanced towards Sergeant. He/she might actually have fallen a bit towards Sergeant, depending on the actual activity of your faction, but then clearly not enough to drop in rank.
Note that falling in "permanent rank" is a lot slower than increasing in it.
Thundgot
Community Manager, English
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Poster: Thundgot at 6/8/2005 11:34:14 AM PDT
Subject: Re: The reason rank gain is slow this week. |
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Q u o t e:
Is pvp a viable alternative to questing and dungeons as you stated when the honour system was first implimented. I have given up questing and dungeons to pvp and cannot see how in any way or form its a viable alternative. Friends and guildmates who dont pvp have left me behind in a big way, more money epics mounts and full armor sets.
Aslo i see plyers who get 7k and go from rank 8-9 i get 5 times that on same server with a standing of first and go from rank 8-9, whats the other 32k doing?
There are two things to consider here:
1. They might have been much closer to rank 9 than you. You on the other hand might be a lot closer to rank 10 than them right now.
2. They might be higher level than you and thus get a better "week rank" than you compared to your respective Honor and Standing for the week.
...or a combination of both. Without the exact details for each of you I can't say.
Thundgot
Community Manager, English
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Poster: Thundgot at 6/9/2005 1:57:06 AM PDT
Subject: Re: The reason rank gain is slow this week. |
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Q u o t e:
I would like to know if its possible to gain 2 ranks in a week though, if getting enough contrib points compared to the rest of the same-side players?
It depends entirely on your rank. Getting the first two ranks in a single week is very possible. Jumping from rank 12 to 14 in a single week is close to impossible.
Q u o t e:
The reason im asking is because i got 25k contrib points last week, and went from standing 8 to 1 on realm. Still gained only one rank (7 to 8). Other players cant have gotten more contrib points than me , so im just asking to know if i could have gained 2 ranks with say 100k contrib points, in theory of course.. :)
With 100k Honor for the week instead of 25k you would have gotten a bigger part of the faction's allocated Honor pool for the week. This might have gained you another rank, and it might not have, depending on where in the range of rank 7 you were and how many points were in the pool for your faction this week.
Thundgot
Community Manager, English
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Poster: Thundgot at 6/9/2005 2:04:48 AM PDT
Subject: Re: The reason rank gain is slow this week. |
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Q u o t e:
Ok, i see what this thread is saying as to people at lvl 8 or 9+ not gaining a rank. However i'm pretty sure Standing 185 (5487cp) last week, should possibly earn me a rank past Sergeant (rank 3) last week i only got about 1800cp (standing 800 or something) and went from Corporal to sergeant..
Shouldnt the transition through the lower ranks be quite fast for an active player?
Advancement on the low ranks should be comparably faster than at the higher ranks, yes. It might be that the previous week only barely got you to rank 3, and this last one just wasn't enough to get you to rank 4.
Q u o t e:
Edit: Just had a revelation - DK punishment came in today right? Could DK's from last month or so be coming back to haunt us now? or does that only start from DK's that occur from this moment forth?
Cuz i got 2 in XR when some random civillian attacked me for no reason and i hadda defend myself :\
Dishonorable Kills should have no effect on this last calculation, as their effect was included in the patch applied after the calculations.
Thundgot
Community Manager, English
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Poster: Thundgot at 6/9/2005 2:10:36 AM PDT
Subject: Re: The reason rank gain is slow this week. |
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Q u o t e:
I was wondering if this can be right... Last week I was Blood Guard (standing 80+), now I made more than 300Hk and my standing is now 43, but I'm still a Blood Guard. I inspected one who had gotten Legionnare promotion, hmmm... more HK's and less CP with standing 84! I was wondering why he had promotion (he said that he just got it), but I didnt, also half of our server didnt get promotion. Last weeks nr.1 is still rank 11 (now standing 3) and person who is now 1 is still Centurion (he had about 20k cp), I mean how can this be righ?
Yes, it can be right.
First of all, HKs are completely irrelevant as long as you made the cut-off (got a Standing number).
The guy getting Legionnaire was probably closer to the rank than you in the first place. As said before, it's completely natural that only a few get promotions this week, and fewer still will get one next week. The guy being rank 11 last week simply didn't get enough to advance. He might actually have declined a bit, though not enough to fall to rank 10.
The top Standing guy this week should have gotten a nice increase, but apparently not enough to get to the next rank. To get from rank 9 to 10 in a single week will on average require a "week rank" of 14 or 15, depending on the faction's activity. If he was on the lower part of rank 9 (which I guess he was) it would require even more.
Thundgot
Community Manager, English
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Poster: Thundgot at 6/9/2005 2:23:37 AM PDT
Subject: Re: The reason rank gain is slow this week. |
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Q u o t e:
Please respond to this Thundgot.
Well i think the system is totally screwed. Last Wednesday both me and X become rank 11. We were accually the only rank 11 on the server. I had abit more CP in total than X. Not much, but was standing 1 every week exept two weeks, one week I got standing 2 and other I got standing 3. But in total I had the most CP.
This week I had several things to do, so only got 20k(usually get 50-75k). X did get 51k. I assume I didnt get rank 12.
But when I logged into the server I got shocked. I was now rank 10. X was now rank 12. In total X has only about 10% more CP than me, but is that enough to be two ranks higher?
X is now the only one that is rank 12. None on my server is even rank 11 now!!! And some are rank 10.
So with 20k I did go from 11 to 10, and with 50k the person went from 11 to 12. That is kinda sick when you think that I was in the lead until this week.
Total CP over the weeks has little to say. It's usually when there's a big difference you'll notice one getting ahead. You say he has 10% more Honor (CP), and I guess you mean the total Honor gained since the system opened. Looking at this value without comparing to everybody else of your faction each week is not going to give you much substantial data, only a rough indication.
But, allow me to calculate based on these three statements:
- You had more Honor than him total before this week
- He gained 30k more than you this week
- He now has about 10% more than you
This means he has no more than 30k more than you right now, meaning you can't have more than 300k total ever (10% you said). Having 300k total now would mean 280k before this week, indicating a weekly average of 50k for you both. This again tells me he you have both been keeping a steady high rank until now, until you dropped 30k in a single week.
Considering you were the only ones to reach rank 11 last week I would think you barely had enough to reach this rank, and thus it doesn't surprise me that you drop a rank by having 30k less Honor this week. I'm a bit more surprised that he gained one. My conclusion is that you guys were actually almost half-way through rank 11 (which is very well done), towards 12, and you personally dropped about half a rank while he gained a little more than half.
Q u o t e:
So this last week must have been a bug. It is not possible from everyone to climb ranks to none climb ranks.
I understand that it is harder to climb ranks when you get higher, but it is NOT a coincidence that everyone react on this on the same time.
The last weeks very few has complained on rank climbing, and now suddenly all find this very strange and complain on it. Is this a coincidence? No cant be, something must be wrong since 80% that PVP dont understand a thing. So if I dont get rank 12 next week, I put WOW on the shelf.
*Confused*
I still don't see any indication of a bug, and the devs have assured us they found no faulty calculations.
No, there's no coincidence that most people level out on their rank gain, and some even start dropping, and thus it's not a coincidence that people react.
I find it extremely unlikey that you will gain two ranks next week. For anyone to ever jump from 10 to 12 in one week would be an outstanding achievement. If you do it I will be impressed. I hope you will reconsider the decision to quit WoW if you don't.
Thundgot
Community Manager, English
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Poster: Thundgot at 6/9/2005 2:30:51 AM PDT
Subject: Re: The reason rank gain is slow this week. |
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Q u o t e:
Well,
first of all, my last week doesn't show and I'm fairly sure that I killed more than 25, if that's what it takes, I don't know.
I do think that my points got counted but I'm wondering why I can't see them.
Secondly, I wonder if there is a way to see your "permanent honorpoints" or will it be implemented?
Now it seems that the Rank and level are the only things that really count.
And thirdly, I won't be playing for about 2 months during this summer and I wonder what will happen with my Rank? I guess I'll lose it since Battlegrounds just came up. I'm just Rank 1, but will I be able to get it back and/or climb higher later?
It very much feels like I'll be quite stuck without Rank then, but I hope the system is smarter than that.
The cut-off for the week might have been a lot higher than 25 HK. It depends on the activity of your faction.
The points behind the ranks are not displayed. It's something that will be considered to allow people to understand the system better though. However. I think the reactions this week are not due to lack of knowledge how many points a player has, but rather due to not understanding why the player gained a lot less than expected (or even lost some).
Having a eight week break from gaining Honor will definitely affect your rank in general. You can stay inactive for very long without losing rank 1 though, and advancing fast later is absolutely doable, especially if you're active in the Battlegrounds.
Thundgot
Community Manager, English
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Poster: Thundgot at 6/9/2005 2:40:32 AM PDT
Subject: Re: The reason rank gain is slow this week. |
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Q u o t e:
Sorry Thundgot but I can smell bullshiit somewhere along the lines..
First of all, the word filter is there for a reason. Please respect it. Second, please try a less confrontational introduction on your post. As I've told others already, claiming something is broken because you don't understand it or didn't get whet you wanted is hardly constructive.
Q u o t e:
How come this is the only week there have been numerous problems in game? Whether its aweful lag, out of sync lag, or just messed up CP's.
This week has not had more lag or sync issues than earlier. Ask around and I think you'll find many people supporting that. So far I have seen no indication of "messed up CPs" except people claiming they should have gotten more from a system they don't understand.
Q u o t e:
My brother a lvl 46 warrior was Sergeant rank 2 weeks ago. The WHOLE - And I bloody well mean, THE WHOLE of last week was spent in Hillsbrad farming Cp's. I expected him to climb, at LEAST one rank [Master Sergeant?] but no, I was in for a suprise when he logged in and he was still Sergeant.
No i'm not one of those people who think "Woot I got 3k of honor kills that must be a rank!" my brothers CP's were HUGE, as he was killing and damaging huge amounts to 50-60's with "Champion" titles "knight's" e.t.c.. you name it he killed them.
Being level 46 means he already does not get as much "week rank" from his weekly Honor and Standing as those of higher levels. Without any details other than "he did it a lot" it's hard to even speculate on it.
Q u o t e:
Now, for you to sit there and tell me "Everything is working as it should be", is plain and simply bullshiit. Why is it only this week?
As said several times before, this is the time when the advancement in ranks will level out for most people. It's perfectly natural.
And I'm still not ruling out the possibility of an error. I just have seen no indication of this error in what people report here on the forums.
Thundgot
Community Manager, English
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| | http://forums-en.wow-europe.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-pvp-en&t=73304&p=#post74262 |
Poster: Thundgot at 6/9/2005 2:45:16 AM PDT
Subject: Re: The reason rank gain is slow this week. |
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Q u o t e:
I have an question to you too thundgot, if you answear it I will close my ticket and quit bugging the GMs
:2 Weeks ago I became Legionnere (rank 8), standing 13 and happy with the new equipment. My server is low-medium so this deed only required about 15k cp.
Not entirely correct. It required 15k Honor for that week plus all the effort you put into getting your rank before. Ranks are not tied to a specific amount of Honor (CPs).
Q u o t e:
1 week ago I became centurion (rank 9), standing 11th and this was done with 20k exp.
See above.
Q u o t e:
Now this week, I am standing 6th and still centurion (rank 9) and now I had even more CP gained then 1 week ago.
See above. You probably increased in "permanent rank" (the points hidden behind your rank), but not enough togain a new rank.
Q u o t e:
The highest rank on my server is/was 11, I havnt found out if he went up or down but it was a big bad suprise how I logged on and for first time see I didnt gain a new rank. Especially as I am standing 6th as high as I ever been =( I also know there was about 5 champions or more on my server so I wonder how I cannot be one too at standing 6th?
Standing 6 means you had good advancement this week, providing your faction was rather active of course. It does not guarantee a rank, but you should be closer now. Keep it up and I'm pretty sure you'll gain that rank next week. :)
Not gaining a rank in a week will be the norm at rank 9 and above. In fact, to most it will be the norm at rank 6 and above.
Thundgot
Community Manager, English
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| | http://forums-en.wow-europe.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-pvp-en&t=73304&p=#post74272 |
Poster: Thundgot at 6/9/2005 2:50:49 AM PDT
Subject: Re: The reason rank gain is slow this week. |
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Q u o t e:
please explain this to me:
a friend had rank 9, standing 30. last week he only did about 30 kills and 800 points. standing 800somthing and STILL RANK 9. why didnt he loose 1 or 2 ranks?
is it really true that people only need 25 kills to hold their rank? cant believe this. this would never be fair to players with lower ranks. they could do 10000000 points and standing 1, but cant reach a higher rank if all high rank players can hold their ranks with just 25 kills.
Your friend might have been fairly close to advance to rank 10. Thus, while he was probably low on the "week rank" and lost a good amount of points he didn't lose enough to drop in rank.
And again, dropping in rank is a lot slower than gaining them. Being 10% more active one week gains you more than you lose by being 10% less active.
25 HK is needed to gain and hold at least rank 1. If you always make sure to have 25 HK you should never be able to lose that rank. It does in no way help on holding higher ranks though. A player recently reaching a high rank is very likely to drop a rank if he only has the needed 25 HK and barely any Honor for the week.
Thundgot
Community Manager, English
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| | http://forums-en.wow-europe.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-pvp-en&t=73304&p=#post74282 |
Poster: Thundgot at 6/9/2005 3:01:02 AM PDT
Subject: Re: The reason rank gain is slow this week. |
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Q u o t e:
Explain this Thundgot. How can someone get from rank 7 to 9 with standing 9(36.000cp), and i had standing 2(70.000cp) and got from rank 7 to 8.
He was 1% from gaining rank 8, gained 102% of a rank, and is now 1& into rank 9.
You were 99% from gaining a rank, got 198% of a rank (almost twice what he got), and are now 1% below rank 9.
Unlikely to be that extreme, but that's an explanation.
Q u o t e:
From first week honor system come and to now I always had better standing then him ;)?
That sounds strange though. Unfortunately I don't have access to the data to check this, but if that's in fact correct it does indicate some error, most likely in one of the earlier calculations.
Q u o t e:
This was some weeks ago. This honour system isnt 100 % bulletproof :P
Never said it was. The claims that it's random or horribly bugged seem largely exaggerated though. ;)
Q u o t e:
I'm rank 11 now and standing 1(80.000cp) and i complain about this to gm's long time ago.
They said they investigate and told me alot people have problems. Nothing has been fixed yet.
I would proberly be rank 12 now if it didnt went wrong. :P
Gaining rank 12 this week would be a great achievement, and not doing so is alone no indication of things going wrong. I know some have done it, and can only applaud them. It does take a lot of work and also a lot of action from your faction to ensure a large Honor pool for each week.
Thundgot
Community Manager, English
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| | http://forums-en.wow-europe.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-pvp-en&t=73304&p=#post74299 |
Poster: Thundgot at 6/9/2005 3:06:55 AM PDT
Subject: Re: The reason rank gain is slow this week. |
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Q u o t e:
this is a BS system flaw then. i pay same money and dont ever have a chance to get higher ranks just because i have a life and job ? there was alot of talk about casual pvpers and equal chances and now you tell me i just can stop going for ranks ? all kids with loads of times will slay me with their epic pvp equip anyways in a month , its just fecked up really
edit: and thinking of it , i guess your wrong. afaik casual players 2h pvp and 2000 cp is worth same than powerplayers 20h and 20000 cp in the calculation.
Time spent on gaining the Honor has no effect on the calculations. It's only the points for the week that are included.
And no, casual gamers will not be able to compete with the hardcore players in this. Nor will a casual gamer get to level 60 as fast or raid Molten Core as early or as often. That's the nature of an MMO - or of any game. Would you expect to have as good a personal best in a car racing game after 5 hours as someone who spends 40 hours per week on it?
But, you're right. The honor system is different than other content. You will get to 60 eventually, and raid Molten Core eventually, and get your top tier class set eventuelly. In the honor system you will not gain rank 14 unless you beat the other players for it. You can attain and hold a lower rank though.
Thundgot
Community Manager, English
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| | http://forums-en.wow-europe.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-pvp-en&t=73304&p=#post74309 |
Poster: Thundgot at 6/9/2005 3:09:08 AM PDT
Subject: Re: The reason rank gain is slow this week. |
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Q u o t e:
One question if you are allowed to answer it Thund?
Are the ranks capped by level? By that I mean I'm currently level 53, rank First Sergeant. Is it impossible for me to gain Stone Guard until I'm level 58 or so? I know level affects CP's but are there actual restrictions?
Reason I ask is I've seen level 60 stone guards with around 500 total kills ever (yes I know HK's have nothing to do with rank) and far less contribution points for the previous weeks than me.
I currently have around 3500 kills, been in the top 100 every week. So should I stop wasting my time and grind to 60 for now? Yes I'm aware I might well loose first serg if I do that.
Ranks are not capped by level, but a given amount of honor for the week will give a level 60 more "week rank" than a level 40. This is not reflected on the Standing though, so a level 40 with Standing 30 might get less advancement than a level 60 with Standing 60.
Thundgot
Community Manager, English
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| | http://forums-en.wow-europe.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-pvp-en&t=73304&p=#post74313 |
Poster: Thundgot at 6/9/2005 4:41:39 AM PDT
Subject: Re: The reason rank gain is slow this week. |
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Q u o t e:
thundgot just wrote that this isnt possible and with the amounts of cp people can farm in BG now it wont be possible for Tyren to get higher now. so whos right ? tyren or thundgot ?
The statements do in no way contradict each other. I said the casual gamers won't be able to compete with the hardcore playes. With hardcore players I mean those that spend the time and have the skill (and understanding of the system) needed to attain the top ranks.
Tyren said that by spending one hour per day on PvP you can keep up with the very best (well, almost). I don't know what activity Tyren's realm has, but I can definitely see that 7 efficient hours per week (one per day to avoid diminishing return for repeated kills) can earn you a standing among the top ranked players. I do expect Tyren to play in a very efficient way in PvP.
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I won't be responding too much on posts the rest of the day, rather writing a new document to explain the system better. I also have a few other things to handle, but hope to have this document ready to send off for approval today.
Thundgot
Community Manager, English
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| | http://forums-en.wow-europe.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-pvp-en&t=73304&p=#post74472 |
