Poster: Tseric at 11/8/2005 5:27:35 PM PST Subject: Concerns & Desires |
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Let it be known that this is something of a first draft and should not be considered the end-all-be-all of Mage feedback. With continued discussion, we can refine this further. You may post any edits you see fit below.
Mage Community Concerns/Desires
Overview-
As the game has progressed in development and other classes have been reviewed and/or buffed, it is a common sentiment that the mage class has been surpassed in effectiveness and players feel relegated to a utility class rather than a master of ranged damage. Several elements serve to illustrate a disparity between this class and others:
- Itemization for melee classes is more robust, allowing for versatility and/or involvement in many aspects of the game. An example being the selection of PvP rewards for melee as compared to caster.
- How damage scales between melee and caster classes in the high-end game is felt to be inconsistent. With basic improvement in stats, the melee classes garner more potential damage output, while casters receive benefits through improved stats that do not assist in improved damage output. An example of this is how crit% can be increased through agility for melee, but caster classes must rely on specific items to improve crit%. With spell effectiveness being capped through spell level, melee classes do not have a similar damage curve, as weapon/armor upgrades are common and allow a continued damage increase at the high-end.
- While mages have the potential to deal solid amounts of damage, this is curbed by the challenge of aggro management. So while mages may still possibly be the best direct-damage casters, in practice they must hold back in raids/dungeons due to a lack of agro management spells/abilities. This is a paradox of paper/practice that mages would like addressed.
- Increased melee damage is allowing players to get closer to "one-shotting" mages. As a mage's health pool is lower than most (if not all) of the other classes, this makes large crits and single melee hits more effective against this class
Spells/Abilities-
- In terms of damage-dealing, the Arcane tree is considered weakest. Any consideration to add more damage potential to this tree would be desired (especially in relation to Arcane Subtlety)
- Added teleportation would be desired. Possible bonuses due to reputation standing for portals. An example being a free/reduced-cost self-port to a main city with which you had Revered status.
- The DoTs added from multiple-sources of spells such as Fireball and Ignite should stack instead of taking up valueable "real estate" in the debuff slots.
- Ice Armor/Mage Armor does not scale at the high-end, decreasing effectivness as players progress through the end game.
- Amplify/Dampen Magic is not used much as spells; The talents for improvement, less so.
- Continued increases to stats/mana pool drives the need for higher level Conjure Water to keep up with demand. It is regarded as simpler/more efficient to make Conjured Water regenerate by a percentage rather than by set quantities.
- Mages would like some enhancement to the functionality of Detect Magic. As it stands, there are few circumstances where this is found to be useful.
[ post edited by Tseric ]
A thousand words are worth a thousand words.
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| | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-mage&t=496940&p=#post496940 |
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Poster: Tseric at 11/8/2005 5:27:42 PM PST Subject: Re: Concerns & Desires |
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Talents-
- Because many mages regard Improved Arcane Explosion as necessary, it would be preferred if it was simply made into an instant-cast spell available through training alone and not through talent point expenditure. The same sentiment applies to Evocation.
- Arcane Focus and Subtlety should affect all spell schools instead of just the Arcane tree.
- Wand Specialization is deemed by many to be worthless.
- Arcane Power is regarded as overpowered and generates "cookie-cutter syndrome" or a necessity to spec in the arcane tree to obtain it.
- The cost and restraints on Combustion do not seem to be worth the talent point investment.
- Improved mana shield would be preferred to scale better.
- Improved counterspell should be merged with the spell, as warlock pets get the silence effect flat-out and a player ability should be more powerful than a pet.
- Pyroblast has an excessive cast time compared to talent point cost. It's damage compared to other fire spells enforces its undesirability in usage.
- Ice Barrier would be considered more effective if it scaled with +dmg gear.
- Ignite is preferred to have the DoT effect removed and have damage dealt in one lump sum.
Items/Itemization-
- It is regarded that fire-resistance on items is too proliferous. This can greatly affect the PvP environment, where melee classes do not necessarily have to sacrifice other bonuses to have a great deal of resistance to a spell school. As it stands, fire spells are having damage mitigated through resistance to an excessive degree.
- Due to game mechanics, +dmg bonuses affect instant cast spells to a lesser degree than longer cast time spells. In PvP, with a desire for burst DPS and overall speed, this is considered to be unbalanced. Melee classes can maintain a consistent damage output while casters are relegated to longer cast times to get the most from +dmg gear.
- Set bonuses for the Arcanist set are regarded as lackluster.
- Zandalarian Hero Charm and Talisman of Ephemeral Power are highly desired and regarded as overpowered (mainly due to the stackable nature). In comparison to other trinkets, the combination of these two stick out quite dramatically.
- The Royal Seal of Eldre'Thalas is felt to be incomparable with other, similar classes' trinkets.
[ post edited by Tseric ]
A thousand words are worth a thousand words.
|
| | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-mage&t=496940&p=#post496942 |
Poster: Tseric at 11/8/2005 5:28:00 PM PST Subject: Re: Concerns & Desires |
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Stats/Mechanics-
- The nature of binary spells works in a way to mitigate damage in a way that is not comparable to other types of damage mitigation. Unlike fire resistance damage reduction, a resisted frost spell will not deal any damage.
- The distinction between how Str/Agi effects melee class damage output and Int/Spi effects Mana cap/regen is not one that sits well with mages. It is regarded that this distinction allows melee classes to continue damage improvement easily, while mages are left only with +dmg gear to increase damage.
- Dispellable effects/talents are a thorn for mages, particularly in a PvP environment. Many top tier talents are desired to be undispellable or incur some cost to dispelling them.
- Melee classes can get crits on sitting characters, while casters can not.
Misc-
- Numerous bugs which have been prevalent for a while affect gameplay negatively for mages. Mages would like more attention invested to correcting these (espc. Blink, Arcane Missiles)
Wish list-
- Allow for some control of direction with blink. An example being, blink in the direction you are moving/strafing.
- Reduce cooldown for Evocation
- Remove the reagent cost for slow-fall
- Mana stones should not be soulbound
- Invisibility!
- A talent that allows for multi-target sheeping
- A knockdown/back effect with Cone of Cold (possibly talent based)
- Make Silence affect Hunters
- A method by which to interrupt melee attacks, much in the way melee classes have caster interrupts
- An Arcane Ward similar to Fire/Frost
- Some manner of dispel (aside from remove curse). Or even, trade spells with the priest class
Disclaimer
Some mages may notice the omission of a frequent request of mages. "Make Conjure Water create more than 4 per cast". This has been considered by the devs on many occassions and has been repeatedly declined. At this time, the devs do not regard this as something overly obstructive to game play and it is up to mages to manage downtime effectively in regards to this spell. Should the need arise in the future, the devs are well aware of this suggestion and will make changes as necessary. In the meantime, 4 per stack it is.[ post edited by Tseric ]
A thousand words are worth a thousand words.
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| | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-mage&t=496940&p=#post496943 |
Poster: Tseric at 11/8/2005 5:40:35 PM PST Subject: Re: Concerns & Desires |
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Q u o t e: Your old signature pwns your new one.
Yeah, it's really just to tide me over until that special catch-phrase comes along...
A thousand words are worth a thousand words.
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| | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-mage&t=496940&p=#post496976 |
Poster: Tseric at 11/8/2005 5:46:54 PM PST Subject: Re: Concerns & Desires |
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Q u o t e: do you think it would be possible to add a quick list of known major bugs? so it may help people to not post the "have you seen ______"? (blink,AM etc)
thanks for the thread!
There already is a list. Bug resolution is really an aside from class issues, so I merely mentioned it, but did not expound.
There is very little I can do to prevent repeat posts ;)
A thousand words are worth a thousand words.
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| | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-mage&t=496940&p=#post496993 |
Poster: Tseric at 11/8/2005 5:40:35 PM PST Subject: Re: Concerns & Desires *edited post* |
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Q u o t e: Your old signature pwns your new one.
Yeah, it's really just to tide me over until that special catch-phrase comes along...
A thousand words are worth a thousand words.
|
| | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-mage&t=496940&p=#post496976 |
Poster: Tseric at 11/8/2005 5:46:54 PM PST Subject: Re: Concerns & Desires *edited post* |
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Q u o t e: do you think it would be possible to add a quick list of known major bugs? so it may help people to not post the "have you seen ______"? (blink,AM etc)
thanks for the thread!
There already is a list. Bug resolution is really an aside from class issues, so I merely mentioned it, but did not expound.
There is very little I can do to prevent repeat posts ;)
A thousand words are worth a thousand words.
|
| | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-mage&t=496940&p=#post496993 |
Poster: Tseric at 11/8/2005 5:28:00 PM PST Subject: Re: Concerns & Desires *edited post* |
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Stats/Mechanics-
- The nature of binary spells works in a way to mitigate damage in a way that is not comparable to other types of damage mitigation. Unlike fire resistance damage reduction, a resisted frost spell will not deal any damage.
- The distinction between how Str/Agi effects melee class damage output and Int/Spi effects Mana cap/regen is not one that sits well with mages. It is regarded that this distinction allows melee classes to continue damage improvement easily, while mages are left only with +dmg gear to increase damage.
- Dispellable effects/talents are a thorn for mages, particularly in a PvP environment. Many top tier talents are desired to be undispellable or incur some cost to dispelling them.
- Melee classes can get crits on sitting characters, while casters can not.
Misc-
- Numerous bugs which have been prevalent for a while affect gameplay negatively for mages. Mages would like more attention invested to correcting these (espc. Blink, Arcane Missiles)
Wish list-
- Allow for some control of direction with blink. An example being, blink in the direction you are moving/strafing.
- Reduce cooldown for Evocation
- Remove the reagent cost for slow-fall
- Mana stones should not be soulbound
- Invisibility!
- A talent that allows for multi-target sheeping
- A knockdown/back effect with Cone of Cold (possibly talent based)
- Make Silence affect Hunters
- A method by which to interrupt melee attacks, much in the way melee classes have caster interrupts
- An Arcane Ward similar to Fire/Frost
- Some manner of dispel (aside from remove curse). Or even, trade spells with the priest class
[ post edited by Tseric ]
A thousand words are worth a thousand words.
|
| | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-mage&t=496940&p=#post496943 |
Poster: Tseric at 11/8/2005 5:27:35 PM PST Subject: Concerns & Desires *edited post* |
| |
Let it be known that this is something of a first draft and should not be considered the end-all-be-all of Mage feedback. With continued discussion, we can refine this further. You may post any edits you see fit below.
Mage Community Concerns/Desires
Overview-
As the game has progressed in development and other classes have been reviewed and/or buffed, it is a common sentiment that the mage class has been surpassed in effectiveness and players feel relegated to a utility class rather than a master of ranged damage. Several elements serve to illustrate a disparity between this class and others:
- Itemization for melee classes is more robust, allowing for versatility and/or involvement in many aspects of the game. An example being the selection of PvP rewards for melee as compared to caster.
- How damage scales between melee and caster classes in the high-end game is felt to be inconsistent. With basic improvement in stats, the melee classes garner more potential damage output, while casters receive benefits through improved stats that do not assist in improved damage output. An example of this is how crit% can be increased through agility for melee, but caster classes must rely on specific items to improve crit%. With spell effectiveness being capped through spell level, melee classes do not have a similar damage curve, as weapon/armor upgrades are common and allow a continued damage increase at the high-end.
- While mages have the potential to deal solid amounts of damage, this is curbed by the challenge of aggro management. So while mages may still possibly be the best direct-damage casters, in practice they must hold back in raids/dungeons due to a lack of agro management spells/abilities. This is a paradox of paper/practice that mages would like addressed.
- Increased melee damage is allowing players to get closer to one-shotting mages. As a mages health pool is lower than most (if not all) of the other classes, this makes large crits and single melee hits more effective against this class
Spells/Abilities-
- In terms of damage-dealing, the Arcane tree is considered weakest. Any consideration to add more damage potential to this tree would be desired (especially in relation to Arcane Subtlety)
- Added teleportation would be desired. Possible bonuses due to reputation standing for portals. An example being a free/reduced-cost self-port to a main city with which you had Revered status.
- The DoTs added from multiple-sources of spells such as Fireball and Ignite should stack instead of taking up valueable real estate in the debuff slots.
- Ice Armor/Mage Armor does not scale at the high-end, decreasing effectivness as players progress through the end game.
- Amplify/Dampen Magic is not used much as spells; The talents for improvement, less so.
- Continued increases to stats/mana pool drives the need for higher level Conjure Water to keep up with demand. It is regarded as simpler/more efficient to make Conjured Water regenerate by a percentage rather than by set quantities.
- Mages would like some enhancement to the functionality of Detect Magic. As it stands, there are few circumstances where this is found to be useful.
[ post edited by Tseric ]
A thousand words are worth a thousand words.
|
| | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-mage&t=496940&p=#post496940 |
Poster: Tseric at 11/8/2005 5:27:42 PM PST Subject: Re: Concerns & Desires *edited post* |
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Talents-
- Because many mages regard Improved Arcane Explosion as necessary, it would be preferred if it was simply made into an instant-cast spell available through training alone and not through talent point expenditure. The same sentiment applies to Evocation.
- Arcane Focus and Subtlety should affect all spell schools instead of just the Arcane tree.
- Wand Specialization is deemed by many to be worthless.
- Arcane Power is regarded as overpowered and generates cookie-cutter syndrome or a necessity to spec in the arcane tree to obtain it.
- The cost and restraints on Combustion do not seem to be worth the talent point investment.
- Improved mana shield would be preferred to scale better.
- Improved counterspell should be merged with the spell, as warlock pets get the silence effect flat-out and a player ability should be more powerful than a pet.
- Pyroblast has an excessive cast time compared to talent point cost. Its damage compared to other fire spells enforces its undesirability in usage.
- Ice Barrier would be considered more effective if it scaled with +dmg gear.
- Ignite is preferred to have the DoT effect removed and have damage dealt in one lump sum.
Items/Itemization-
- It is regarded that fire-resistance on items is too proliferous. This can greatly affect the PvP environment, where melee classes do not necessarily have to sacrifice other bonuses to have a great deal of resistance to a spell school. As it stands, fire spells are having damage mitigated through resistance to an excessive degree.
- Due to game mechanics, +dmg bonuses affect instant cast spells to a lesser degree than longer cast time spells. In PvP, with a desire for burst DPS and overall speed, this is considered to be unbalanced. Melee classes can maintain a consistent damage output while casters are relegated to longer cast times to get the most from +dmg gear.
- Set bonuses for the Arcanist set are regarded as lackluster.
- Zandalarian Hero Charm and Talisman of Ephemeral Power are highly desired and regarded as overpowered (mainly due to the stackable nature). In comparison to other trinkets, the combination of these two stick out quite dramatically.
- The Royal Seal of EldreThalas is felt to be incomparable with other, similar classes trinkets.
[ post edited by Tseric ]
A thousand words are worth a thousand words.
|
| | http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-mage&t=496940&p=#post496942 |